Things you SHOULD know about your RAM/Memory

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Things you SHOULD know about your RAM/Memory

Postby gohcht » Sat Jul 29, 2006 3:31 pm

I work for a major OEM memory manufacturer, we supply most major companies with the memory they include in there machines or keep for servers and or upgrades from their customers. I just thought I would share some of the things I have seen and learned in this business over the last few years.

Do You NEED or HAVE room for more memory?
http://crucial.com/pcworld

Is your memory failing you?
http://www.memtest.org/ (this is not the original but you can link to it from this page)
http://www.bootdisk.com/ram.htm

Rule # 1 - Never go back to your dealer or OEM for your memory, you can always get a better deal.
Response # 1 - Yeah but it says I can only use this, or my warranty will be null and void....... Any place that says only their memory or vendor will work right (there are a VERY few exceptions) is LYING to you. We build 1 module label it 20 different part #’s for 8 different OEM’s and ship them accordingly. It so funny knowing the part #'s (retail that is) for 5 diff parts on a site all priced diff but in actuality if you bought one of each they would be the same. If your worried about your warranty use a heat gun for 5-10 seconds for the tamper proof label on the and keep the old memory tucked away to put back should you ever need to send it in for repair or upgrade. Usually the Tamper proof label is only on one side anyway so there are many ways to get in and out and keep your warranty. Dell even offers PC’s that are upgradeable by the user now with warranty so…..Regardless if they are bad or not any memory that has the void if removed label on it and is still in warranty try to RMA. If for nothing else any old stuff you have (ie pc66) will be replaced with pc100 or pc133 as pc66 is almost extinct as far as major OEM's go. So you get a free upgrade, just see what is no longer available.

Rule # 2 To further rule # 1 see below for list that most of the time applies, always check to make sure in forums and dealers/manufacturers sites that there are no specific bugs or failures with your Board/type/specs/Vendor/OEM of your system with the Board/ type/specs/Vendor/OEM of your future dram:

Legacy:
70 nos (nano-seconds) can always use 60 nos and 50 nos can always be used for 60 nos and usually 70 as well. Can never use 60 for 50 or 70 for 60.

SDRAM PC66 can always use Pc100, which can always use PC133. Cannot ever use higher 100 for 133 or 66 for 100.

DDR
2100 can use or be substituted with 2700 which can use 3200 which can use 4000 never the other way

Rule # 3 never ever listen to a sales guy, ever! Even if he told you the Lotto #'s and they win that night, never believe a sales guy. You'll see why shortly.

Unbuffered or UB* usually refers to density’s x64 (64x64, 128x64, 32x64) and mean they do not have a register, PLL and or Buffer on them, and are NON-Error correcting (NON-ECC)

Buffered usually means its Registered and ECC x 72 (64x72, 128x72)
ECC (Error Correcting) always is x72 based density.
REG or Registered modules are clock skewed (speed) and are best used in a server since they have a consistent timing that is not meant to adjust but stay steady, like a server. Unbuffered x64 are better used in workstations and desktops, laptops ect. they are not timed tightly and allow the memory load to fluctuate greatly without negative results.

Cost:
Memory, better to sell than cocaine, quite a wonderful world of smoke and mirrors. The memory market is purely based on people’s lack of knowledge and resources. Oh and the evil DRAM manufacturers that are basically the oil industry of electronics. They can build as much or as little as they want and supply who at whatever price at whatever time they want, and often use this to manipulate the market prices how they wish. You can see this quite often in the business section or technology section of any newspaper by the amount of lawsuits dram manufacturers are part of all the time.

Prices are approximates and change rapidly and often, this should give you a good idea of how where you go and what you know can be the difference between $1-$250 per module in some cases.
Here are today’s 9/27/05 market prices for memory (standard 512 MBDDR 64 based) which is the price that is paid for said product at this moment, below that are the sale prices as of today for the common
vendor, if none of this makes sense to you this guide may help:
http://www.kingston.com/tools/umg/default.asp

Unless you are reading this as I am writing it (for those of you wondering if you are, it's impossible) the prices are purely for example and certainly have changed. You can find the current "market" prices in many places, here is one:
http://www.converge.com/www-webapp/pric ... Detail.jsp

Size Config Low High Forecast
512 MB DDR 64Mb x 64 - 266Mhz $42.50 $45.00 Stable
512 MB DDR 64Mb x 64 - 333Mhz $42.50 $45.00 Stable
512 MB DDR 64Mb x 64 - 400Mhz $42.50 $45.00 Stable
512 MB DDR2 64Mb x 64 - 533Mhz $42.00 $44.00 Stable

Vendor sale prices:
512 mb pc3200 ddr 400 184p unbuffered non-ecc:

HP - $80
Dell - $72
Kingston - $60
Smart - $60
Crucial - $75
Fry's - $45-60
Newegg - $40-65
c-net $45-65

The above example is a very basic one, there are cases where I sell for 105 to one customer parts that cost me $80 which they sell @ $110-$250 based only on the label and or part # it goes out their door as.

Here is one example, now remember the Market cost:

DE467-A PC3200 400 184P ||||HP FRYS PDP MUSHKIN EDGE
DE467-A PC3200 400 184P $291|| $55|| $60|| $90|| $70||

The DE467-a is a 512 MB DDR SDRAM Memory Module - 512MB - 200MHz DDR400/PC3200 - DDR SDRAM - 184-pin DIMM the same as all the above.

BUT::: Let me make sure to mention that the reason the prices are so much less because you get a crap warranty often having to deal with 3rd party’s or OEM not Seller on of the product if you have RMA's, or need Tech Supoport. The also will most likely be using parts not approved by the manufacturer, and go through a mediocre test process on a go no go test not specific to your hardware. This in reality is similar to the windows pop-up that says this driver has not been signed. Obviously buying from OEM" or CM's will always get you the best "Quality and higher performing part, and good customer support, but for most users as long as it does not fail the difference will not be noticed. I'll list below my opinion of the best in quality.

Intel
AMD
Samsung
iNFINEON
Hitatchi
MICRON
NEC

OEM 's and CM'S (Original Electronics Manufacturers, Contract Manufacturers)

HP - USE CM'S
SUN - USES CM'S
SMART - MANUFACTURES FOR HP, CISCO, SUN, THEMSELVES
CRUCIAL - MANUFACTURES FOR HP, CISCO OWNED BY MICRON WHO MANUFACTURES FOR HP(COMPAQ) SUN AND CISCO
Kingston - MANUFACTURES FOR CISCO, THEMSELVES
SIMPLETECH - MANUFACTURES FOR CISCO, THEMSELVES
PNY - MANUFACTURES FOR CISCO, THEMSELVES
PDP - THEMSELVES

Tip: Counterfeiting of HP, Compaq, Cisco and Sun is a BILLION dollar a year business, don't buy from shady characters, If the deal is far of in $ from the Oem or approved reseller price it is a fraud, remember kids major no matter who you buy it from if it is certified it is contract pricing, so any major price difference should make you wonder WHY. If you will pay anywhere near OEM price then get from the OEM or a Company that shows their part #'s and
test analysis/results and comparisons.

Once you get into the server side the real fun and price manipulation begins.

Anyways point is don't let the scare tactics fool you, (I have installed the wrong memory many a times with little lost but time) and look up the market price of your memory and go to someone who offers a good service with a comparable price to their cost.
http://www.simmtester.com/page/memory/memprice.asp
http://www.converge.com/www-webapp/pricing

to price modules from dram -
dram cost x amount of devices per + maybe 5-20 bucks is ballpark. Add closer to five for Legacy and closer to 20 for new to the market memory.

Resources:
http://www.crucial.com/promo/index.asp? ... Y418508803 -
http://www.smartm.com/main/index.cfm
http://www.kingston.com/products/default.asp


I will end here, any questions on memory feel free to ask and I will answer best I can.

You can find one from someone I just met recently after I read one he wrote, but much better than mine, IMO....

Understanding, Identifying and Upgrading the RAM in your PC
http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/tutoria ... al122.html
Last edited by gohcht on Sat Jul 29, 2006 10:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby NoUse » Sat Jul 29, 2006 6:12 pm

Very nice tutorial. There is some good info there. Also, nice external links.


Also, you've posted the second half of the tutorial twice:
BUT::: Let me make sure to mention that the reason the prices are so much less because you get a crap warranty often having to deal with 3rd party’s or OEM not Seller on of the product if you have RMA's, or need Tech Support. The also will most likely be using parts not approved by the manufacturer, and go through a mediocre test process on a go no go test not specific to your hardware. This in reality is similar to the windows pop-up that says this driver has not been signed. Obviously buying from OEM" or CM's will always get you the best "Quality and higher performing part, and good customer support, but for most users as long as it does not fail the difference will not be noticed. I'll list below my opinion of the best in quality.
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Postby Nullset » Sat Jul 29, 2006 10:51 pm

Once again gohcht .... very well done as always nice links ....nice tutorial .... i just couldnt understand some of it ..
maybe because I dont know much ... but googling right now for some info.... though i got teh hang of it ... good job !!!
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Postby gohcht » Sat Jul 29, 2006 10:54 pm

Thanks NoUse, what a Maroon I am....

Thanks n_0_0_b, I definetely believe in the importance of looking up your questions as you will answer the other 10 you did not know you had yet by doing so, but it is sometimes complicated stuff and I am known to confuse people with my ramblings, so feel free to ask away and I'll do my best to answer.

T H C
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hidding folder options icon

Postby sonixz » Wed Aug 09, 2006 9:10 pm

please help me how to hide the folder option icon on control panel
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Re: hidding folder options icon

Postby gohcht » Wed Aug 09, 2006 9:33 pm

please help me how to hide the folder option icon on control panel
Hmmm, I do not believe I covered that very hot ram topic in the tut, whare is my head? I will have to edit that in, thanks for the input...

The easiest way to answer your question is to copy the core of it, like so
hide the folder option icon on control panel
paste in g o o o g l e and THEN you will be taken here:
Works with most if not all common questions....
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